There were a lot of things George MacDonald helped me with when I first encountered him in college. One of the things I was starting to struggle with, mightily so, was with certain visions of God that regulated particular theories of salvation.
For example, I was struggling with images of a wrathful and bloodthirsty God. That the God I was called upon to worship could only be appeased by the spilling of blood. What sort of God was that? The whole vision seemed pagan to me. And that's what I concluded, that most of contemporary Christianity is just Paganism 2.0.
MacDonald helped me forward. He gave me the confidence to replace those pagan notions of god with the God of Jesus Christ. Last week I told you I was reading back through MacDonald's novel Donal Grant. It was passages like this one from Donal Grant that proved so helpful to me:
"...in Jesus Christ I see the very God I want. I want a father like him..." [said Donal to lady Arctura,] "...No other than the God exactly like Christ can be the true God. It is a doctrine of devils that Jesus died to save us from our father. There is no safety, no good, no gladness, no purity, but with the Father, his father, and our father, his God and our God."
"But God hates sin and pushes it!" [exclaimed lady Arctura.]
"It would be terrible if he did not. All hatred of sin is love to the sinner. Do you think Jesus came to deliver us from the punishment of our sins? He would not have moved a step for that. The horrible thing is being bad, and all punishment is help to deliver us from that, nor will punishment cease til we have ceased to be bad. God will have us good, and Jesus works out the will of his father. Where is the refuge of the child who fears his father? Is it in the farthest corner of the room? Is it down in the dungeon of the castle, my lady?"
"No, no!" cried lady Arctura, "--in his father's arms!"
"There!" said Donal, and was silent.
Yes, ultimately back in the Father's arms is where any child wants to be WHATEVER the circumstances. This does not necessarily have to preclude the fact that this very same 'father' is wrathful to others though. What about those who offend or threaten his children? Will those people find a welcome of love in his 'arms'? What of the tyrant who wants to not only overthrow the father but actually wreak havoc upon his family and ultimately destroy his children? Can he too expect a welcome of warmth and paternal love?
I fully realise that the metaphors are being stretched to their limits here and yet I am only responding to the one you gave. It's fascinating exploring these ideas of the eternal God isn't it and once again we just can't escape from our own agendas, experiences and life-stories. All theology is biography comes alive again and again doesn't it.
Great passage to stimulate our thoughts Richard. This is a seriously valuable blog...
Yes, ultimately back in the Father's arms is where any child wants to be WHATEVER the circumstances. This does not necessarily have to preclude the fact that this very same 'father' is wrathful to others though. What about those who offend or threaten his children? Will those people find a welcome of love in his 'arms'? What of the tyrant who wants to not only overthrow the father but actually wreak havoc upon his family and ultimately destroy his children? Can he too expect a welcome of warmth and paternal love?
I fully realise that the metaphors are being stretched to their limits here and yet I am only responding to the one you gave. It's fascinating exploring these ideas of the eternal God isn't it and once again we just can't escape from our own agendas, experiences and life-stories. All theology is biography comes alive again and again doesn't it.
Great passage to stimulate our thoughts Richard. This is a seriously valuable blog...
Yes, ultimately back in the Father's arms is where any child wants to be WHATEVER the circumstances. This does not necessarily have to preclude the fact that this very same 'father' is wrathful to others though. What about those who offend or threaten his children? Will those people find a welcome of love in his 'arms'? What of the tyrant who wants to not only overthrow the father but actually wreak havoc upon his family and ultimately destroy his children? Can he too expect a welcome of warmth and paternal love?
I fully realise that the metaphors are being stretched to their limits here and yet I am only responding to the one you gave. It's fascinating exploring these ideas of the eternal God isn't it and once again we just can't escape from our own agendas, experiences and life-stories. All theology is biography comes alive again and again doesn't it.
Great passage to stimulate our thoughts Richard. This is a seriously valuable blog...
"There are ‘traditions of men’ after Christ as well as before him, and far worse, as “making of none effect’ higher and better things; and we have to look to it, how we have learned Christ. Good souls many will one day be horrified at the things they now believe of God. "The Christian religion, throughout its history, has been open to more corrupt misrepresentation than ever the Jewish could be, for as it is higher and wider, so must it yield larger scope to corruption: -- have we so learned Christ in false statements and corrupted lessons about him, or have we learned Himself? "What I insist upon is, that a man’s faith shall be in the living, loving, ruling, helping Christ, devoted to us as much as ever he was, and with all the powers of the Godhead for the salvation of his brethren. It is not faith that he did this, that his work wrought that – it is faith in the man who did and is doing everything for us that will save him: without this he cannot work to heal spiritually, any more than he would heal physically, when he was present to the eyes of men."-George MacDonald, Unspoken Sermons
Martyn, I have spent a fair amount of time thinking about the theory of God = Love interpreted to mean at least inclusive of anger/wrath. In that same vein, the sin/punishment paradigm that follows from it. Where I stand, at the moment, is in the belief that the biblical narrative and/or church doctrine that uses anger/wrath/sin/punishment as an explanation of God's nature and will is missing the bigger picture. The symbolism in the Scriptures of God as "consuming fire" has caused me to reflect on the refining, purifying aspect of fire. Also, discipline (teaching, not punishment) is meant to help us become fully human, in the image of God. I am more and more hopeful that, ultimately, all will rest in our Father's arms, having been made complete (perfect, whole). Blessings and Peace to you, Martyn.
Paganism 2.0. Nice one.
How exciting to be reading the same book as you - I'm on the last couple of chapters. I can see why it's your favourite. Cracking yarn (N.E. England idiom: 'a strong storyline'!!), a satisfyingly unrepentant baddie or two, an intriguing mystery, atmosphere, a sprinkling of deaths and last-minute rescues - and some ecstatic and glorious theology thrown in to boot. Wonderful stuff.
But who willingly runs into the arms of a father as vengeful as the one we revere? It's a scary thought, at the very least.
Am I alone in perceiving some physical likeness of Richard and George MacDonald; the nose, cheekbones, beard, and mustache? I wonder what this may mean. I am definitely growing my beard and massaging my cheeks. I already have the nose.
...and a beautiful example of MacDonald at his understated best at the end. I thought of this blog when I read the last line:
"I will let what light I have shine; but disputation is smoke. It is to no profit! - And I do like to give and to get the good of things!"
Amen.
...and a beautiful example of MacDonald at his understated best at the end. I thought of this blog when I read the last line:
"I will let what light I have shine; but disputation is smoke. It is to no profit! - And I do like to give and to get the good of things!"
Amen.
ANDREW, PATRICIA, JIM, SUSAN, AND RICHARD (and anyone else),
I do not wish to intrude here, other than to once again say thanks to all for the wonderful support over the past four weeks. I have something to share (today's post) at my own blog, for those who may be interested.
http://empiricalmeta.blogspot.com/
Always stimulating! Here's a kind of simplistic thought: Is Paul saying we die because of sin or do we sin because we die? Obviously he didn't have the opportunity to read Becker or Beck for that matter, so do we exegete and attempt to formulate a Pauline paradigm for a Biblical theology hopefully transcending cultural conditionings and applicable to every age with the best research tools available. or is this just another anachronistic vestige of a woefully inadequate Biblicism struggling for air? Thanks for always providing lots of very meaty food for thought.
Thanks, Sam, for sharing this. I am so encouraged that, in and through this trial of grieving your father's death, you are finding healing and peace. You must have been a great comfort to your sister.
I think that all of the time spent reading and in community here at the ET blog has given you a strength of spirit to make sense of all that has happened in your life. I know that the reading I have done, and the gentle people whom I have encountered here, have been edifying and encouraging to me over time.
Also, I have found that, in my worst moments -- the "dark night of the soul", God is most easily sensed and known. Confirmation for me of His mercy and goodness. He is near to the brokenhearted.
Sam, I am glad that you recorded all the details of your vivid dream right away. I have had this experience with dreams, usually during a time of deep grief or duress, and over time, as I have examined the symbolism of those dreams and have progressed on in my faith and life experiences, the meaning of the dreams has become even more significant to me. As I read the details of your dream, the absence of fear, the fullness of beauty, and by extension, a sense of the loving presence of God are such hopeful and healing signs. Imagine me in that great cloud of witnesses cheering you on, Sam. ~Peace~
Hi, Sam. I loved your description of the vivid colours. I expect you've read the end of the Narnia series? It reminded me of this - as well as of the film "What Dreams May Come". I also think of sin in terms of obscuration - and live in the hope that one day we shall see clearly. As Paul put it after his magnificent paean to the love that never fails: then we shall see face to face...I shall know fully, even as I am fully known. Maybe then we will realise just how loved we were through it all. Maybe then we won't ask for that apology.
Peace to you Sam. That is beautiful. Thank you so much for sharing.
I feel honored that you would choose to share this beautiful experience with us. Thank you so very much Sam. I am so glad that your struggles over the last few weeks with your father's passing have led to the peace that this dream has brought to you.
"I'm not at all certain about the notion of "faith" now, since I feel that I know. I do not need to "believe" anymore."
This really resonates with me, Sam, as I have been blessed with a similar vision... that of the peace of "knowing" that all will be well.
Thanks for the blessing of sharing your life with us.
I believe this is a typo: "But God hates sin and pushes it!" [exclaimed lady Arctura.]
Shouldn't that be "punishes"?
Thanks for posting this. MacDonald has a way of communicating his noble vision of God that is unsurpassed.